Comments

Quite Observer wrote on Feb 8, 2008 5:06 PM:

" Mr. Roundabout, Thanks! Informative article and link. Here's why the proponents want one of these things (quoted from the linked article):

"The standard design of roundabouts also create a far safer environment for pedestrians, which is appreciated by commercial developers. By slowing traffic and improving access, roundabouts are conducive to economic development." "




Mr Roundabout wrote on Feb 8, 2008 4:20 PM:

" The roundabout revolution in America is on!

Great article on roundabouts!

www.delawareonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080206/OPINION07/802060329/1108/OPINION "




Researcher wrote on Feb 8, 2008 10:25 AM:

" Courier don't let them get away with this sort of misleading information. Do a Google search of these projects.

Development watcher you must be Rip Van Winkle! Indian Bend Corporate Center was built over a decade ago back in 1996.

from:
www.elliottpollack.com
"Mr. Merritt served as Land Development Manager for The Northern Equities Company, the developer of the Borgata of Scottsdale..." certainly doesn't say Exeter Development. The Borgata of Scottsdale built in the late 1970's. "




Are you kidding me? wrote on Feb 8, 2008 9:28 AM:

" I hope someone is able to back up what is now in the public domain; "... attempting to strong arm potential clients away..." and I don't mean make wild claims in the Court of Public Opinion via the Courier, how about in Superior Court.

Green must be superman or something if the bumbling mayor of a rural postage stamp town can scare away the mighty developers from Scottsdale. Amazing.

Pollster? You're informal poll of what? The families of the incumbents? (rolling around laughing) "




Pima2 wrote on Feb 8, 2008 7:37 AM:

" I hope to see this kind of thing to and i hope the citizens don't have to pay anything for it. Now wouldn't that be nice. Doing development in Scottsdale is alot like doing develpment in Safford (NOT), except for the good ol boy mentality here. "




Development Watcher wrote on Feb 7, 2008 11:18 PM:

" Ahhh feeble memories, The mayor has caused hundreds of thousands of dollars in damages already by attempting to strong arm potential clients away by saying he would not allow the development to happen. Green is a failure of a business man and has already ran 5 businesses into the ground. The Indian Bend Corporate Center was built a couple of years ago and the built-to-suit Sony building was just before that. Take a trip to Phoenix and see how nice these places really are, then complain if you must. I would love to see something of that caliber here. "




Pollster wrote on Feb 7, 2008 11:05 PM:

" Have You Noticed:

Cotter doesn't need any help winning this election. Our informal poll shows he leads Green 85 percent to 15 percent. "




Have you noticed wrote on Feb 7, 2008 7:42 PM:

" Hey Development Watcher, Since the Wilmot project is proceeding as you suggest, why is Talley sueing Green and the city? Seems there is no reason.

Since the mayor has no power to fire the wrecking crew from La Paz, why have they made such a public issue out of what looks like a crazy mayor who can do nothing?

Is this all about Cotter winning the race for mayor? Is this the campaign strategy? Looks like it from what you've said. "




Ahh Memories wrote on Feb 7, 2008 7:38 PM:

" Development Watcher; if as you say, Wilmot will proceed with or without a city tennant, how has progress been stifled by the mayor? Didn't Councilmen Ortega tell us that developers are free to proceed as they wish (and ADOT has to adapt the roadway for them later)? And when were those Exeter projects completed you cite (in the past 5 years)? So unless FMC/PD leases space, who are the major tennents to secure the financing of this development (without city participation)? "




Development watcher wrote on Feb 6, 2008 8:06 PM:

" Ahh poor memory, Wilmot is not new to the development game. He has constructed the Borgata of Scottsdale and has built condominium projects at Troon North Golf Course in Scottsdale, Greyhock Golf Course and McCormcik Road. He also built the Indian Bend Corporate Center and a built-to-suit Sony Corporation complex. His project will be done with or without any city tennants. Unfortunately progress has been stifiled by the mayor and a law suit against him is pending. Wilmot has always said he plans to begin construction in the second quarter of 2008 so keep watching!? "




Ahh Memories wrote on Feb 6, 2008 5:49 PM:

" Informer, nice try bucko. Who's putting up the $100million bucks? Why haven't they broken ground? Why are they waiting for the council to move the police station to the new Commerce Park? Can the roundabout be huge enough for the big trucks without incroaching on existing property outside the highway right-of-way? The nice drawings you saw at the meeting were not to scale. If its a great economic gain, why isn't there a long list of major name tennents? Or didn't you think about these things? "




To Informer wrote on Feb 6, 2008 4:31 PM:

" Since you attend so many meetings and seem to know so much about the roundabout, please answer this question- What diameter size is being proposed? Some of us want to attend meetings but are unable to. This is why the meetings should be taped and put on TV or on the city website. I hear this may happen soon. Once this does happen we will all have an opportunity to view meetings regardless of work schedule or other conflicts.
"




Bill Smith wrote on Feb 6, 2008 3:04 PM:

" Roundabouts work in Idaho, I don't think the residents of the Gila Valley are smart enough for such an advance roadway! "




Informer wrote on Feb 6, 2008 1:40 PM:

" There is already a school zone where the speed limit is 15mph on Hwy. 70 in Thatcher, or did you forget. The roundabout in Bisbee was built in the 1940's. This is a modern roundabout. The preliminary proposal I saw at the public meeting in Sept. did not encroach on any existing buildings. Did you not care enough to attend? True a traffic control change is needed if the development is built. A $100 million development that will bring great economic gain to Safford. Why are you opposed to improving Safford? Or would you rather have dead, wasted land? "




Ahh Memories wrote on Feb 6, 2008 1:20 PM:

" informer, you mean we'll all have to slow to 15mph (the school zone speed) on a state highway during rush hours? Oh, that's just dandy! All so some development interests can make a buck on a deal with no announced tennents except maybe a new police station??? Well, at least they'll be around (and around) to write us tickes as we go round and round.

Jon, yeah - I've experienced these beasts (they have one in Bisbee). And, if its big enough for the huge trucks, just how much land will it eat up? "




Jon Johnson wrote on Feb 6, 2008 11:01 AM:

" Topnotch, I have not driven any buses or semi-trucks through any roundabout. If anyone has, please leave a comment on your experience. Like I said in the editorial, however, with all the facts pointing to the increased safety, and what I have been shown regarding how much quicker traffic flows versus a stoplight, I would like to see if it is as good as a traffic control system that ADOT says it is. I think their engineers are more qualified to determine that than I am. For more info. check our advanced search archives for previous roundabout articles. "




informer wrote on Feb 6, 2008 10:50 AM:

" The reporter neglected to mention the fact the roundabout will have two lanes and yes size matters, extensive reports have been done and it will easily be able to accommodate even the largest PD/FM haul trucks. You also won't get stuck in the circle because those inside have the right of way. As for the ones in Mexico and New Jersey, those are probabley traffic circles and not roundabouts. There is a big difference! Traffic circles are indeed hard to navigate through heavy traffic, modern roundabouts are not. The speed limit the roundabout is 15mph. "




Topnotch wrote on Feb 6, 2008 10:33 AM:

" It doesn't look to me like there is enuogh room to build an adequitly large enough roundabout on 10th & hiway 70 withoug tearing down the GSA building or will it all circulate through the Cotter/Talley/Wilmot money making "park"? "




Topnotch wrote on Feb 6, 2008 10:11 AM:

" I wonder how many Semi's or buses Jon Johnson has driven anmd how in a "roundabout"? "




Big Trucks wrote on Feb 6, 2008 10:05 AM:

" What about those big trucks PD brings in? How big would a roundabout need to be for them? If a roundabout is on the highway how will these large trucks go through town? "




Size Matters wrote on Feb 6, 2008 9:44 AM:

" The SIZE of the roundabout is the determining factor of the turning radius. Therefore to accommodate the turning radius of a semi-truck the roundabout would need to be a certain size. Has an engineer determined what is the minimum diameter needed to accommodate the turning radius of a semi-truck? If so, what is the diameter needed? Is there room to make the roundabout large enough for a semi-truck? "




From Experience wrote on Feb 6, 2008 8:58 AM:

" Roundabouts on heavily used roads are a nightmare. In New Jersey, where they are in love with them, if there is an accident on any road feeding into the roundabout, all of the roads backup causing major traffic delays and preventing emergency vehicles from quickly responding. Roundabouts might work great someplace, but they are not meant to handle the variety of traffic in Safford. ie. farm equipment, oversize loads, and hazmat. "




Ahh Memories wrote on Feb 6, 2008 8:00 AM:

" I don't care about reports, studies, or how they work in Europe and Mexico (first one I encountered was in Mexico); have you ever encountered or driven in one with moderate to heavy traffic?? They're easy to use in light traffic - but in heavy traffic? You'll go round and round a couple of times before getting out of the darn thing. "




Pima2 wrote on Feb 6, 2008 7:12 AM:

" Roundabouts are ok if the speed limit is 25 mph or less. Anything above that you will start to see the low side of them. Just loook at some and notice all the black marks on the curbs. They are a idea that the state will push just like photo cameras. Good and bad issues but that's all you get. Slow down and enjoy the ride. "